WW XXIX Dor-en-Gaur

[Rikae]

Durelin, the words "jumped on" were yours. That's why I put them in quotes. Apparently, you want to act as though they were my words in order to put me in a bad light.

To clarify, I used them sarcastically.

[Lalwendë]

Originally Posted by Thinlómien

One thing that makes me think Lal's a wolf even more is her reactions to the current situation. If she was innocent, she'd be more desperate to stay alive, after all, if Ang decides to kill someone and gets it wrong, and the wolves slaughter 2 people at night, this lynch is a decisive one...
Now she seems to accept her defeat and death, something wolves (especially unexperienced ones) keep doing. (I know that from experience, that's just what I did when I was a wolf, and I ended up a Fenris.)

EDIT: xed with Rikae's later post

It seems that once suspected if you take it calmly you are doomed and if you fire off you are doomed, so there's nothing to read into it at all, sadly. Once a mob has decided then that's it. Remember what happened when Durelin defended Volo? She was suspected, so why bother when it gets to this stage? It only dooms you too; very Darwinian. And Mithalwen has made it clear that if I now reveal as the other Ranger she won't believe me and she will tell everyone else not to believe me, so there is no point in doing what would now be my only defence. All I can do is stand by my convictions and trust to hope in the vote.

[Durelin]

I agree with you, Ang about the cozyness, going along with everything. But just also remember a silent Wolf is the one that so often lives...

Lordy, tough job for you, eh?

[Mithalwen]

Farael will be removed from theh equasion if he has another no show I think - which is another reason to hang fire .....

[Durelin]

Aha. Like Naria was? Well, that's tricky...

[Rikae]

Originally Posted by Thinlómien

One thing that makes me think Lal's a wolf even more is her reactions to the current situation. If she was innocent, she'd be more desperate to stay alive, after all, if Ang decides to kill someone and gets it wrong, and the wolves slaughter 2 people at night, this lynch is a decisive one...

I would think that if she was a wolf, she'd pull the "I'm Brian and so's my wife" gifted reveal stunt. It seems to be the trend these days.

EDIT - X'd with Lal & Durelin

[Anguirel]

You know, I think Rikae's innocent. All this grammarian stuff is too mad and obsessive to be Macchiavellian, in the nicest possible way!

If Lal turns out to be guilty I'll probably go for Kath; if Lal is innocent I will not endanger the village's survival willfuly.

[Durelin]

All this grammarian stuff is too mad and obsessive to be Macchiavellian, in the nicest possible way!

Pfft...if she's so mad and obsessive then why isn't she backing up her words with a vote for one of us "Gifted-posers?"

[Thinlómien]

Mr Bond, I think saying this is probably useless, but even if we manage to lynch a wolf today, I think you should be careful with that golden dagger of yours. I know it's no use me telling you it is not very wise to stab me since I'm innocent (because I doubt that'd make you any less suspicious of me), but whoever you stab - me or someone else - I think you should reread their posts carefully through and not to be rash.
But, then again, I guess you're not so stupid that you wouldn't see that, so maybe I'll just shut up about this...

edit: xed with everyone on this page except Rikae's first post

[Rikae]

Durelin, you're the only one I don't trust, as I've explained several times. I have reasons to believe the other two; you, on the other hand, have no evidence in your favor. I'm voting for Firefoot because I would like my vote to actually be of some use, and as I've said, she's the mosst suspicious person I've seen in this or any other village.
Fair enough?
Somehow I think you'll try to twist my words yet again...

[Mithalwen]

If Durelin is lying then we have 2 rangers who have not declared themselves which in current straits is mind bogglingly unlikely ......... one is odd enough...

[Boromir88]

To also point out it's not just today that Rikae and Lal have distanced from eachother, but that seems to be the trend this entire time in the village. Talk about using some logic Rikae, that's not at all an uncommon move for wolves or gifteds who know eachother.

Ang you may have a point, but I do ask you to think of this. Mostly Rikae and Lal have not mentioned eachother, only recently has Rikae been protesting Lal's lynching...now it seems that this would be a bold move for a wolf, but let's consider the options here and which one would be the most suspicious move:

1) To suddenly turn on Lal and vote for her with the rest of us?
2) To keep on defending Lal and make it look like she is defending her so greatly that she can't possibly be a wolf?

[Anguirel]

How long have we got till Farael is killed for being silent? I need to take that into my calculations...

I've only just remembered, it's Eiliniel we're lynching now. Tragic indeed...sorry, m'lady, I have not exactly acted towards you as a brother-in-law should. I only hope you deserve it...

[Thinlómien]

Lal, what I would have expected from an innocent villager was not a "I'm the ranger"-thing, but a genuine panicky reaction along the lines of "you can't do this! I'm innocent!"

++LALWENDE

EDIT: mass x-posting

[Lalwendë]

Mithalwen, no genuine Ranger is going to reveal now - as you've made it clear nobody will now believe them, and why risk the whole village if nobody's going to believe you?

[Rikae]

Originally Posted by Lalwendë

And Mithalwen has made it clear that if I now reveal as the other Ranger she won't believe me and she will tell everyone else not to believe me, so there is no point in doing what would now be my only defence.

I spoke too soon.

Lal, if you are really a ranger you should reveal yourself. You won't do the village any good dead; maybe you'll still get lynched but you should at least say something.

[Mithalwen]

Once again you miss the point......

[Thinlómien]

It's two days without participating/voting that is "allowed"...

[Durelin]

I have no need to twist your words, Rikae, dear...I just wonder how one person makes a trend. Oh, wait, you're right...I am quite the trend setter... *was likely the first person to wear chucks and tights...

[Mithalwen]

She said defence ..not that it was the case......less than 5 minutes ...

[Lalwendë]

Originally Posted by Thinlómien

Lal, what I would have expected from an innocent villager was not a "I'm the ranger"-thing, but a genuine panicky reaction along the lines of "you can't do this! I'm innocent!"

I learned my lesson after panicking last night when Firefoot turned up last minute and everyone ended up changing their votes en-masse. No more panicking. Que sera, sera, of however its spelled.

maybe Je Ne Regret Rien would be better?

[Anguirel]

It would be among the biggest fiascos I've ever witnessed - and believe me, that's saying a lot - if Eilinielwende did turn out to be a Ranger after we hanged her...

Part of me kind of expects that to happen, in fact...

[Mithalwen]

She said defence ..not that it was the case......less than 5 minutes ... At least we will be rid of an awful lot of negativity.....

[Rikae]

Originally Posted by Anguirel

It would be among the biggest fiascos I've ever witnessed - and believe me, that's saying a lot - if Eilinielwende did turn out to be a Ranger after we hanged her...

Part of me kind of expects that to happen, in fact...

Than do something about it.

[Thinlómien]

Originally Posted by Anguirel

It would be among the biggest fiascos I've ever witnessed - and believe me, that's saying a lot - if Eilinielwende did turn out to be a Ranger after we hanged her...

Indeed...

[Thinlómien]

Rikae, it's a bit too late. 2 minutes.

[Rikae]

One vote switched to Firefoot would do it.

[Anguirel]

If she is a Ranger, then I'm the most efficient Ranger-killer in town!

[Durelin]

Ang - I'm starting to feel you might be right about Lommy. Maybe...very maybe. (Well, obviously, I guess...)

[Nogrod]

Voting is closed.

Lal's death will be up soon...

[Boromir88]

If Lal's a ranger I'd hang myself.

No, because Lal is not a ranger, she's accepted or fate and is going down in style and having a bit of fun with it.

Anyone given a role is given a set of directions of that role, if there are any confusions they ask the Nogmod...Lal greatly misinterpretted the ranger role...this has already been pointed out by Mith.

[Nogrod]

After all the somewhat puzzling events of the Night the Villagers seemed all to have made up their minds at last. They had an idea how the things were and held on to their thoughts, letting no argument to twist their minds, Gorlim's Lighthearted Brother’s announcement possibly not included.

The stern looks of the villagers started concentrating on a few persons while a host of them were having none of the attention. Two suspects made it to the top. There was Eiliniel, Gorlim’s wife and the Homeless Wife. Some voted for one, some for the other. Surely, the Mathematician, the Weaver and the Moose Tamer got their fair share of suspicion but those never materialised as votes. In the end it was still quite clear who would have it this Day.

“It amazes me that Lal and Rikae are both persisting with conspiracy theories; one would think wolves would avoid such stubbornness to avoid implicating each other...perhaps one is a misguided innocent.” Gorlim’s Lighthearted Brother declared. “I shall stay my knife till after the lynch. And I'll vote to lynch Lalwendë”. With that he draw back.

“I find the most suspicious person today being Lalwendë and this is probably the most confident I've felt this entire time”, said the Serious Jester.

“I don't see me finding enough evidence to put anyone ahead of her so I will stick to my guns...” said the Frivolous Serving-Wench.

“Lal, what I would have expected from an innocent villager was not a "I'm the ranger"-thing, but a genuine panicky reaction along the lines of "you can't do this! I'm innocent!"” said the Ugly Shepherdess.

The Villagers were gathering around her.

“And why not, as inconsistency seems to be a factor shared by those both suspected and those not suspected right now. If I go in a new path I will be doomed and if I retread old ones I will be doomed.” She tried.

“Once a mob has decided then that's it.” She added, still trying to make a brave face.

“Que sera, sera, or however i’ts spelled. Maybe Je Ne Regrette Rien would be better?” she sighed as the villagers were up to her en masse.

She was felled down as the villagers went over her. She was not resisting too much.

The Serious Jester hoisted him up from the overall meddle.

The Homeless Waif gave her a blow with her walking stick.

The Serving-Wench strangled her with the kitchen towel as the Augur started sawing her right arm off with her small and dull knife.

The Ugly Little Shepherdess felt that that was too much and took the knife she beared with her to defend against the normal wolves in the pasture and sank it to her chest.

Lalwendë’s body yanked and started transforming. It started growing dark black hair and her overall posture changed into something really weird. Half-human – half-wolf she turned out to be. She didn’t struggle, she only transformed into something pretty odd and died.

And there she was, a half-hairy werewolf laying on the square a knife in her chest.

The villagers had at last made a right decision.

But Eiliniel! How could that be? What would Gorlim think of that?


Dead:
Volo – The Cryptic Lens Grinder – (ordo) hanged on Day1
Macalaure - Eiliniel's Witty Younger Brother Who's Always Right – (ordo) killed to his bed on Night2
Roa_Aoife - The Town Fletcher – (ordo) killed from behind while dozing off in the middle of her room on Night2
Celuien - The Innkeeper – (Ranger) throat slit on Night2
Morm – (ordo) beheaded on Day2
Eomer - A Beekeeper – (ordo) stinged to death by his own Bees on Night3
Gil-Galad - A Confused Philosopher – (ordo) sliced by the pendulum on Night3
Rune son of Bjarne - A Moonshiner – (Informer/cobbler) hacked to death with the golden dagger on Night3
Lalwendë - Eiliniel, A Retired Village Idiot – (beta-Wolf) – Mobbed and in the end stabbed to the chest on Day3

Alive:
Durelin - The Augur of the Village
Rikae - A Superstitious Mathematician
Thinlómien - An Ugly Little Shepherdess
Kath - A Weawer
Boromir88 - The Serious Jester
Mithalwen - A Frivolous Serving-Wench
Farael – A Moose Tamer
Anguirel - Gorlim's Lighthearted Brother, Anguirel the Merry
Firefoot - A Homeless Waif


Night4 is on.


Wolves PM me your kill, Rangers send me your protections. Others with something to say, PM as well...

Good Night!

[Nogrod]

The Hunter remade his list of the three he suspected. He had turned his mind around now. He was waiting for the wolves to come but they didn’t. He heard some noises though...

There were steps he heard from outside but it was silence after them.

Then there were the sounds of a struggle. He thought for it a while and then decided to stay out of it. He had to stay alive anyway...

....................
The Ranger that had decided to protect the self-declared Hunter had frozen at his front door.

Soon she heard the steps in the dark. They were coming straight to her.

Someone or someones were moving in the Night and she didn’t like the way it sounded. She was getting more alarmed, sensing everything she could. The Augur pulled her cloak away to hear better but at the same time another of the wolves was on her. She fell down and tried to fight back, drawing her sword as the wolf went on her. The other one nicely threw the sword away as it came to her throat. The sword disappeared at the moment.

“You villains! “, Durelin shouted as her last words. The wolf bit her to the throat and killed her with that. “But you didn’t get him...” she managed to mumble before she died.

The Ranger was dead.

The wolves looked at each other and smiled...


Dead:
Volo – The Cryptic Lens Grinder – (ordo) hanged on Day1
Macalaure - Eiliniel's Witty Younger Brother Who's Always Right – (ordo) killed to his bed on Night2
Roa_Aoife - The Town Fletcher – (ordo) killed from behind while dozing off in the middle of her room on Night2
Celuien - The Innkeeper – (Ranger) throat slit on Night2
Morm – (ordo) beheaded on Day2
Eomer - A Beekeeper – (ordo) stinged to death by his own Bees on Night3
Gil-Galad - A Confused Philosopher – (ordo) sliced by the pendulum on Night3
Rune son of Bjarne - A Moonshiner – (Informer/cobbler) hacked to death with the golden dagger on Night3
Lalwendë - Eiliniel, A Retired Village Idiot – (beta-Wolf) mobbed and in the end stabbed to the chest on Day3
Durelin - The Augur of the Village - (Ranger) overcome by the wolves while guarding another Villager on Night4


Alive:
Rikae - A Superstitious Mathematician
Thinlómien - An Ugly Little Shepherdess
Kath - A Weawer
Boromir88 - The Serious Jester
Mithalwen - A Frivolous Serving-Wench
Farael – A Moose Tamer
Anguirel - Gorlim's Lighthearted Brother, Anguirel the Merry
Firefoot - A Homeless Waif


Day4 has started. Please do your best...

8 persons: Two wolfs, three Gifteds, three ordinaries...

[Boromir88]

I feel like momentum is swinging in our favor, but we still have a lot of work to do, so let's get to it:

After thinking and going through a lot I kind of wished Ang decided to go after Kath. There's something about Kath that looks terribly wolfish. Her defending than suspecting of Lalwende. What I mean is on Day 1 in post 58:

Lal seems a little defensive about the whole quiet thing. Not entirely sure what to make of that. She jumped on Lommy a bit for saying she wanted to look out for the quiet ones as well as replying to Boro on the same lines. Might keep an eye on her. Her relative newbieness as well as having seen the arguments over the loud/quiet thing last game might explain the worry but I think it's still worth looking out for.

It's this 'defend-suspect' thing towards Lal that looks truly wolvish. It's kind of like 'ya Lal looks strange' but then she writes it off as Lal being relatively new and nothing to worry about. She defends and suspects Lal in the same paragraph and that looks like a the move of a wolf especially with us knowing Lal is now a wolf. This is not the only time Kath does this with Lal either;

as she does the same in post 233:
Lal - I think is still finding her feet. She was overly defensive at first but she has been coming up with her own theories and has been quite decisive. If Lal was a wolf this would be her first time and I don't believe she would be so confident.

This just seems all to awkward, again using Lal's relative newbieness as a defense.

This looks strange because looking at Lal I definitely can't call her a newbie. Yesterday she knew what she was doing and she had this village worried, she went down in style. And as Lal herself says she's not so 'green' to this, and based on seeing her yesterday I would agree. So, Kath making Lal this defense that 'since she's newer she probably wouldn't be acting like this' looks like a wolf.

And again in poster 385:

Lal I still believe to be innocent. I have not played with her before but she seems a well intentioned innocent who has become caught up in the game. Those of us who play often know the possibility of being suspected for anything and everything and watch our words, and I think it's that which has caused Lal trouble. I don't think it's anything wolvish.

She finally gets away from 'Lal is a newbie defense' and moves to Lal probably just got caught up in saying some wrong things.

Kath's defenses (and suspecting of) Lal definitely looks wolvish.

Rikae is a tough one to look at, before yesterday she had been doing the same thing as Kath when it came to defending Lal.

Lalwendë - She seems the same as last game; since she's so new, I doubt she would seem that way if she were evil.

This is looking like one of those odd-looking defenses of somebody. It's the 'newbieness' defense again, but even stranger than Kath's. It just doesn't make sense...Since Lal looked the same in the last game we should not think she would be the same as a wolf because she's newer to the game?

I say Rikae is a tough one to figure out, because at the end yesterday she was really defending Lal to her death. And you have to wonder would a wolf do that. So now the question is what I asked towards the end of the day yesterday...would Rikae look more suspicious by jumping on with the rest of us against Lal? Or by ardently defending a wolf to her death? As I certainly don't agree with what Volo said about Rikae. She's been in enough of these to know what to do in situations and to know what looks wolvish and what doesn't.

I believe Firefoot and Mith to be innocent. I know Anguirel is innocent. I'll be back on Thinlo and Farael. These two I'm kind of struggling with...I can't imagine a wolf acting the way Farael is; luckily if Farael doesn't show up today my understanding is he's removed? And Thinlo in some instances looks very innocent, but in others just doesn't have a right feeling and I'll get to more about that when I return.

[Boromir88]

Oh that quote of Rikae defending Lal is from Day 2, post 206 I believe.

[Nogrod]

Originally Posted by Boromir88

luckily if Farael doesn't show up today my understanding is he's removed?

Yes, he will. But he needs only to post or vote to be in game toDay anyway...

[Firefoot]

I'm not really all that surprised that Durelin was the one killed - and it was all the more likely if the other ranger had protected her last night and if the wolves knew it from the cobbler. Leaving only one ranger left alive will just make it easier for them to keep on getting a kill at night. It's disappointing, but not surprising.

So who's left? I don't see any point in wasting effort trying to prove Ang and Boro aren't really gifted. That leaves:

Farael - I'm not sure about him - no definite suspicions or anything; I'm fine with letting this play out as to whether he posts today or not. I'm not inclined to concentrate on him, not just because of that but because there are others higher up on my suspicion list.

Rikae - Strange as it may sound, I'm actually not as sure of her as I thought I was. I keep going back and forth as to whether I think she's a wolf or not, which is why I was glad that the vote went to Lal and not to her yesterDay. My vote could still go to her pretty easily toDay.

Thinlómien - I hope I haven't been trusting her primarily because she's been trusting me. Some of the things she has said look very planned, in retrospect - the same thing that made me suspect Lal yesterDay. I'd like to believe she's innocent, but there are so few suspects left that I'm not ready to write anybody off.

Kath - Lal's being guilty has made the argument against her much more convincing. Her lynching might not be a bad idea.

Mithalwen - She's probably the least suspicious of these last four and the least likely to get my vote unless someone can make a convincing case against her.

Just as a heads-up: I won't be getting home until about a half-hour before the deadline, so I may cast an early vote tomorrow morning just to be safe. Hopefully though I'll have enough time to read through the rest of the Day's discussions so as to make a more informed vote... but you won't be hearing much from me toDay as far as analysis goes.

[Farael]

Farael is an ordo, even though you won't believe him.

Farael can't really be bothered to pay much attention to this game, he has made a mistake and signed up for one werewolf too many, and he just can't read up on everything.

So guys, I'll leave it to you. I am an ordo, and I want to stay in-game because with so few players left, an ordo leaving gives the wolves a bit of an edge... If you want me to quit, I just will... but I'm an ordo and I'd advise you to keep me around so that, at the very worst, I'll help the villager to wolf ratio.

Having said that,

++Loomy is a wolf.

[Thinlómien]

Based on that last post I think Farael is an ordo... if he's not, he's a deceitful and non-fairplay wolf... I mean, using non-existent real life excuses as a tactic is something I really dislike. I'm assuming he's busy as he says.

~*~

Of others...

Ang and Boro are gifteds.

I'm innocent.

Mith feels so innocent.

So: Rikae, Firefoot and Kath. Which two are wolves? The problem is that the remaining one might be our ranger, so we have to be careful.

~*~

I don't know what to think of these three ladies. I will probably go through their posts once more. (Or twice more, or thrice more, or... anyway, you get the picture. )

Rikae's the one who's been troubling me the most. Does her shameless attack on Durelin prove she's a wolf who was pretty desperate yesterday? Or does it prove she's an innocent since that would be too bold for a wolf? I don't know... And was she a wolf desperately trying to save a fellow (Lal) to preserve the right to two kills per night? Or again, is she a very misguided innocent? Would this be too bold for a wolf? Or would a wolf trust that she can do what she'd like to, and double-bluff will act as a cover?

Firefoot... I used to be quite certain of her innocence, but I'm not anymore. Because, obviously, if Rikae is innocent after all (and Mith and Farael are, as I assume), she has to be a wolf. Her opportunist campaign against Ang on Day2 was a bit weird, and certainly her little slip yesterday too... On the other hand, if she was a wolf, why would she have voted morm on Day2? Why wouldn't she have just voted Dury earlier and vanished? Her own life was at stake back then; quite many people suspected her. A wolf-Firefoot would know that she'd be blamed for voting an innocent either way, so why to risk her life, even slightly? Of course she could be bluffing, but would it be worth it from a wolf's point of view?

Kath then... The only clear thing in my picture about her is that she's silent. Very quiet. I'd love her to speak up more, I have the feeling she's been slipping under the radar. I used to have a feeling she's innocent, and I'd love to realise from what did it actually come from, and is it still relevant.

~*~

I'm pretty confused and must unfortunately vote sometime pretty soon, and won't probably be back (unless I manage to drag myself to a public library before the deadline. I'll maybe do it if I leave the school library so early that it really makes a difference - the public libraries close quite early).
(See admin thread about my relative quietness toDay.)

[Thinlómien]

Okay, I've reread and thought about things. The remaining wolves must be Rikae and Kath. Not because they're screamingly suspicious, but because everybody else seems innocent.

Firefoot just can't be a wolf. On Day2, Lal voted her pretty late, tying her with me and Durelin. Lal also forgot that Firefoot's vote was yet to come.
Also, I think Firefoot couldn't be a fellow wolf of Kath's: Kath forgot about her - genuinely, I think - and she also tried to get her lynched both Day2 and yesterday, a bit too bold for a wolf... If Kath-wolf had realised her fellows, Lal and Firefoot, were the vote candidates, I think she would simply have voted Lal.)
I don't think she can be a fellow wolf of Rikae's either... I doubt wolves would quarrel that much.
And I dont think Mith or Farael (I'm more assured about his innocence after rereading Lal's posts; her consistent speculation about me and Farael being fellow wolves is something I think a wolf would rather be speculating about two innocents than about an innocent and a fellow wolf) are wolves, so Firefoot must be innocent.

I will most probably vote either Rikae or Kath toDay.

~*~

I also noticed that Lalwendë was a beta-wolf (whatever that means) and we still have some sort of alpha-wolf to handle... I hope that's insignificant if a wolf's alpha or beta, but I have the feeling Noggie might have something nasty for us in his sleeve... But maybe we shouldn't be worried about the alpha-wolf for we have no means to find out how it works (if it works) and alpha, or beta, we should lynch a wolf, though we don't lose the game if we don't manage to do so today... so no such pressure as yesterday.