Why couldn't Merry ride his own horse to Gondor? - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

Potatothan · 12-31-2003, 08:49 AM

Reading the prologue (sp?) of lotr it says that Bandobras Took was big enough to ride a horse and was only surpassed by merry and pippin in size. So that would mean that Merry and Pippin could ride a horse too. So why does Merry accompany the king on a pony? Was there no other horse availeble for him or something? Kinda silly if you ask me really. [img]smilies/biggrin.gif[/img]

~Potatothan

P.S. This is my first book thread, don't shoot me for being ignorant. [img]smilies/frown.gif[/img]

Lord of Angmar · 12-31-2003, 09:01 AM

Although perhaps Merry and Pippin may have been tall enough to ride a horse, it is probably more of a question of skill. My guess is that neither of them possessed the horseback riding ability to keep up with the Rohirrim.

Could you provide a quote that says that Bandobras Took was capable of riding a full-grown horse? I must have read it, but I forget the exact words. Thanks.

Falagar · 12-31-2003, 09:20 AM

Perhaps the entdraught hadn't finished it's work yet (and they took another draught at the end of RotK, if I remember correctly).

And of course it's a matter of skill as well...

Potatothan · 12-31-2003, 09:24 AM

Well, altough my version is dutch, it kinda translates to this:

Quote:

Prologue page 18 "Conserning Hobbits"

According to the Red Book Bandobras Took, the son of Isegrim the second, was one meter thirtytwo and able to ride a horse. In all Hobbit tales he was passed by just two fameous figures from the elder days: but this extrodenary case is mentioned in this book.

The two ofcourse being Merry and Pippin. Hm, it indeed says he was "able" to ride a horse, but doesn't say that he did it. But that does not have to mean anything.

Merry's love for the king was great, and the king referr's to Merry as a burden. So the king obviously thinks he can't manage riding a horse, which he can because of his height.

Falagar · 12-31-2003, 09:40 AM

Quote:

Merry's love for the king was great, and the king referr's to Merry as a burden. So the king obviously thinks he can't manage riding a horse, which he can because of his height.

You need more than height to ride a horse, and as said above it may be that they hadn't grown tall enough yet (it probably took some time)

Bandobras Took · 12-31-2003, 10:04 AM

i THINK THAT IT WAS JUST that a pony is easy for them to ride than a huge horse

Kalimac · 12-31-2003, 03:24 PM

I'd say that "able to ride a horse" implies that Bandobras actually did it (he's also mentioned in The Hobbit, as being "so huge - for a hobbit - that he could ride a horse.") It would be a strange statement to make if he hadn't actually done so - it doesn't have that obviously-metaphorical feel that something like "He was so huge he could chop down a forest in single day" would have.

As for Merry - just because he's now big enough to ride a horse (he's about the size of some of the smaller jockeys) doesn't mean that he's automatically going to know how to do it, and I'd imagine that riding his pony earlier was a somewhat different experience. To pull him off the pony and put him onto a war-horse would not necessarily produce great results. Furthermore, like anyone who's just had a growth spurt (and he and Pippin have had substantial ones) Merry's probably going to be a bit clumsy in his new body at first; more liable to knock into things or mishandle them. It isn't the time for him to be learning how to handle a new animal in a life-or-death situation, and there's no time to train him.

Now from Theoden's point of view, he's probably just looking at Merry and thinking "Too short, too inexperienced in fighting." It may not cross his mind that technically Merry is big enough to ride a horse, but I doubt that would change his mind if it did. The above objections would probably be enough for him, most notably the one about having no time to teach him.

Teleri · 12-31-2003, 03:38 PM

Not to mention the fact that a horse from Rohan might be bigger than your average horse.
Though you could compare Merry's hieght to a jocky, we must remember that this is War. Perhaps Merry could manage a horse without armour, but throw in that, plus pikes, shields, and swords, and the situation becomes a lot more complicated. He would need a sword much too big for him to even be able to deal a blow.

Finwe · 01-01-2004, 12:35 PM

Even if Merry "trained" night and day, he wouldn't have been able to ride and fight with the cavalry. Most of the Rohirrim were trained since childhood in the use of sword, pike, shield, and warhorse. Merry didn't have that training, and thus, was at a big disadvantage. At best during the final charge, he'd fall off his horse and cause a large-scale riot, because a horse's instinct is to avoid a moving object on the ground, and all the other horses would immediately shy away from him. Now, does Theoden really want that?

12-31-2003, 08:49 AM	#1
Potatothan Haunting Spirit Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Traveling from one warm bed to another Posts: 52	Why couldn't Merry ride his own horse to Gondor? Reading the prologue (sp?) of lotr it says that Bandobras Took was big enough to ride a horse and was only surpassed by merry and pippin in size. So that would mean that Merry and Pippin could ride a horse too. So why does Merry accompany the king on a pony? Was there no other horse availeble for him or something? Kinda silly if you ask me really. [img]smilies/biggrin.gif[/img] ~Potatothan P.S. This is my first book thread, don't shoot me for being ignorant. [img]smilies/frown.gif[/img] __________________ Are we humans or are we called humans?

12-31-2003, 09:01 AM	#2
Lord of Angmar Tyrannus Incorporalis Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: the North Posts: 833	Although perhaps Merry and Pippin may have been tall enough to ride a horse, it is probably more of a question of skill. My guess is that neither of them possessed the horseback riding ability to keep up with the Rohirrim. Could you provide a quote that says that Bandobras Took was capable of riding a full-grown horse? I must have read it, but I forget the exact words. Thanks. __________________ ...where the instrument of intelligence is added to brute power and evil will, mankind is powerless in its own defence.

12-31-2003, 09:20 AM	#3
Falagar Haunting Spirit Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Norway Posts: 69	Perhaps the entdraught hadn't finished it's work yet (and they took another draught at the end of RotK, if I remember correctly). And of course it's a matter of skill as well... __________________ Auta i lomë! Aurë entuluva! "Take no heed! We speak as is right, and as King Finwë himself did before he was led astray. We are his heirs by right and the elder house. Let them sá-sí, if they can speak no better." -Son of the Therindë

12-31-2003, 03:24 PM	#7
Kalimac Candle of the Marshes Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Flyover Country Posts: 780	I'd say that "able to ride a horse" implies that Bandobras actually did it (he's also mentioned in The Hobbit, as being "so huge - for a hobbit - that he could ride a horse.") It would be a strange statement to make if he hadn't actually done so - it doesn't have that obviously-metaphorical feel that something like "He was so huge he could chop down a forest in single day" would have. As for Merry - just because he's now big enough to ride a horse (he's about the size of some of the smaller jockeys) doesn't mean that he's automatically going to know how to do it, and I'd imagine that riding his pony earlier was a somewhat different experience. To pull him off the pony and put him onto a war-horse would not necessarily produce great results. Furthermore, like anyone who's just had a growth spurt (and he and Pippin have had substantial ones) Merry's probably going to be a bit clumsy in his new body at first; more liable to knock into things or mishandle them. It isn't the time for him to be learning how to handle a new animal in a life-or-death situation, and there's no time to train him. Now from Theoden's point of view, he's probably just looking at Merry and thinking "Too short, too inexperienced in fighting." It may not cross his mind that technically Merry is big enough to ride a horse, but I doubt that would change his mind if it did. The above objections would probably be enough for him, most notably the one about having no time to teach him. __________________ Father, dear Father, if you see fit, We'll send my love to college for one year yet Tie blue ribbons all about his head, To let the ladies know that he's married.

12-31-2003, 03:38 PM	#8
Teleri Animated Skeleton Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: U.S.A., though I'd prefer the Shire Posts: 45	Not to mention the fact that a horse from Rohan might be bigger than your average horse. Though you could compare Merry's hieght to a jocky, we must remember that this is War. Perhaps Merry could manage a horse without armour, but throw in that, plus pikes, shields, and swords, and the situation becomes a lot more complicated. He would need a sword much too big for him to even be able to deal a blow. __________________ "But after coming all that way I don't want to give up yet. It's not like me, somehow, if you understand."

12-31-2003, 10:04 AM	#6
Bandobras Took Pile O'Bones Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: The Green Dragon Inn Posts: 22	i THINK THAT IT WAS JUST that a pony is easy for them to ride than a huge horse

01-01-2004, 12:35 PM	#9
Finwe Deathless Sun Join Date: May 2003 Location: The Royal Suite in the Halls of Mandos Posts: 2,609	Even if Merry "trained" night and day, he wouldn't have been able to ride and fight with the cavalry. Most of the Rohirrim were trained since childhood in the use of sword, pike, shield, and warhorse. Merry didn't have that training, and thus, was at a big disadvantage. At best during the final charge, he'd fall off his horse and cause a large-scale riot, because a horse's instinct is to avoid a moving object on the ground, and all the other horses would immediately shy away from him. Now, does Theoden really want that? __________________ But Melkor also was there, and he came to the house of Fëanor, and there he slew Finwë King of the Noldor before his doors, and spilled the first blood in the Blessed Realm; for Finwë alone had not fled from the horror of the Dark.