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02-06-2007, 09:44 AM | #1 |
Wight
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Hudson Valley, NY
Posts: 111
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The Great Eye In Dol Guldur?
This thread: http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showthr...997#post508997 got me thinking about an intriguing scenario...
What if the White Council had not driven Sauron from Dol Guldur? How would the trilogy be changed? How would the Fellowship's mission be affected? Gandalf mentions in Unfinished Tales that Sauron would most likely have attacked the North first... how would this have changed the unfolding story? One thing that occurs to me right off is that Mt. Doom would be much more accessible, and thus the Ring easier to destroy...
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02-06-2007, 11:57 AM | #2 | |||
A Voice That Gainsayeth
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: In that far land beyond the Sea
Posts: 7,431
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Extra Concilium nullus Comitatus
Interesting question and first, I have to say that I'd like very much to explore this possibility. But, I have to swiftly (and unfortunately, for this idea of yours, which I like nevertheless) add the facts which make the answer quite clear.
I'll try to sum it up clearly. The main thing is, unfortunately, that the story will not end well. The fate of Middle-earth is quite dark in this case. Quote:
Now I'd better show why. So, here we go: 1. Sauron remains in Dol Guldur. However, by that time he has already sent all the Ringwraith to reoccupy Mordor (around the year 2000. The attack on Dol Guldur happened in 2851). And even if he did not until this time, he certainly would later. He wanted Mordor. He just didn't want to be too obvious. But when prepared, he'd return to his lands. Thus, Quote:
2. Even if Mordor itself were not guarded. We know that Sauron wanted (or at least Gandalf think so, and quite logically) to attack Rivendell and Lórien. I'll include a larger part from the Unfinished tales to make it completely clear: Quote:
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02-06-2007, 02:04 PM | #3 |
Wight
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: The best seat in the Golden Perch
Posts: 219
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I'm in agreement with Legate.
Even assuming that the sole difference was Sauron's continued presence in Dol Guldur, and that everything else (up to a point) was identical to the book (just for fun), there is no way the Fellowship would have gone near Lorien after the escape from Moria. Mount Doom may have been more accessible (if Mordor wasn't infested with Nazgul and orcs), but one would have to be in the general vicinity of Mordor to be able to avail of that accessibility in a useful way. The Gap of Rohan would still have been closed, the route through Lorien (or between Lorien and Mirkwood) would have been madness, so that would have left either going around the White Mountains by west and south, or taking a similar route to Bilbo's through Mirkwood, then down the River Running and across land. Both would have taken too long, and who knows what mischief the Big S would have gotten up to in the meantime.
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02-06-2007, 03:13 PM | #4 |
Itinerant Songster
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: The Edge of Faerie
Posts: 7,066
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Just supposing that things could have gotten so far, Gandalf would have raced to Hobbiton after the fall of Lorien, and perhaps taken Bilbo with him to Minas Tirith; this because he was not yet sure of the Ring, but too suspicious to leave it and Bilbo unsafe in Hobbiton. Thus he would have had to avoid Imladris, which would have been too close to the advancing forces of Sauron from Dol Guldur, and would have found Caradhras no better than in the story that did happen. And then he would most certainly have avoided Moria, since there was no Lorien anymore to escape to afterward. This would have sent him right by the front door of Saruman in Orthanc, who would have welcomed them in for refuge; only to turn traitor and take the Ring from them. Or so it seems to me, taking this and that into account.
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02-07-2007, 12:22 AM | #5 |
Shade of Carn Dűm
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Posts: 257
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I don't know if the storyline would have changed since Sauron was basically ready to leave for Mordor when driven out by Saruman, anyway.
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02-07-2007, 10:06 AM | #6 |
Odinic Wanderer
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I don't think the answer is as simple as you all make it out to be. . .
Scenario1: Sauron keep Dol Guldur as his main base . . .This will most likely mean that Mordor will be easier to get to, still quite a task though. Now we don't know how strong Dol Guldur actually was, but it seems certain that it could not hold the ammount of troops as Mordor and Sauron would not be able to get re-inforcments un-noticed. So it is likely that the North would actually be prepared for a fight and I am not at all sertain that Lothlorien would fall. Sauron would also have to fight the Elves of Mirkwood! It could very well be that the main difference would be that traveling down the Anduin would be a very dangouress action. Scenario2: Dol Guldur is kept as a fortress, but Mordor is the main base of Sauron. . . . .well, yeah then the fellowship would probably fail. Last edited by Rune Son of Bjarne; 02-07-2007 at 10:11 AM. |
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