Why'd Sharkey do that? - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

littlemanpoet · 12-28-2005, 09:35 AM

Here I am trying to figure out a plotline for an rpg and it suddenly strikes me that Sharkey didn't deign to bother the Four Hobbits returning from the War until they get to Hobbiton. Doesn't turn the Battle of Bywater in his own favor, none of it. What happened? Why didn't Sharkey do more? Couldn't he?

the guy who be short · 12-28-2005, 10:03 AM

I'd say it was a mixture of underestimation and Lazy Boss Syndrome.

He underestimated the four hobbits in not realising what they'd be able to do before they came to the Shire.

Thereafter, he continued to underestimate all hobbitry, allocating the job of keeping order to his Ruffians. He thought they'd be able to handle it themselves without involving him.

That's how I see it.

Eomer of the Rohirrim · 12-28-2005, 10:52 AM

I think Saruman knew deep down that, when Frodo returned to the Shire, his Doom was at hand. He makes mention of Frodo tarrying on the road home and thus he is able to do considerable damage to Frodo's home. The way he says this implies that he didn't want to hang around the Shire when the Heroes came back, and his meek surrender of Bag End confirms this.

The attempted murder of Frodo suggests that he wanted to die.

littlemanpoet · 12-28-2005, 07:17 PM

Wanted to die? Do you really think so? Granted, he's been reduced to a shadow (pardon the Tolkienian pun) of what he had been, but death wish? Do you really think he had it thought out that much?

Come to think of it, Saruman does seem little wiser than an orc at the end, what with his spiteful revenge and sneering way, especially directed at Wormtongue, who I feel is the second most tragic figure in the entire story after Gollum. Uh oh, I suppose there's a thread about most tragic figure somewhere in all this forum, isn't there?

Bêthberry · 12-28-2005, 07:54 PM

Well, I had always thought it was a spiteful act of meaningless malice on Sharkey's part to ruin the Shire. He'd lost his chance at the big hand, but he still could ruin something that was precious and special to the man/wizard who had defeated him at the larger game. It was also a way to poison Gandalf's victory.

Elu Ancalime · 12-28-2005, 08:06 PM

I dont remember the exact statment gandalf said, about capable of doing 'a little bit of meaness'........but i suppose he didnt want the travellers to return to the shire if he could still fight in 'some small way.' i dont think he thought he would 'win,' but with Wormtounge turning on hom and jumping him, i think he had no thought of that at all. if wormtounge didnt stick him, who knows......he might have escaped into the East and set up some small tyranny and brought technologu and industry to men, as Weapons and Warefare put it. I think he knew he couldn't achive anymore in the West, he was just a bug up somebodys shirt.

? odd analogy......
________
Headshop

12-28-2005, 09:35 AM	#1
littlemanpoet Itinerant Songster Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: The Edge of Faerie Posts: 7,066	Why'd Sharkey do that? Here I am trying to figure out a plotline for an rpg and it suddenly strikes me that Sharkey didn't deign to bother the Four Hobbits returning from the War until they get to Hobbiton. Doesn't turn the Battle of Bywater in his own favor, none of it. What happened? Why didn't Sharkey do more? Couldn't he?

12-28-2005, 10:52 AM	#3
Eomer of the Rohirrim Auspicious Wraith Join Date: May 2002 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 4,859	I think Saruman knew deep down that, when Frodo returned to the Shire, his Doom was at hand. He makes mention of Frodo tarrying on the road home and thus he is able to do considerable damage to Frodo's home. The way he says this implies that he didn't want to hang around the Shire when the Heroes came back, and his meek surrender of Bag End confirms this. The attempted murder of Frodo suggests that he wanted to die. __________________ Los Ingobernables de Harlond

12-28-2005, 07:54 PM	#5
Bêthberry Cryptic Aura Join Date: May 2002 Posts: 5,997	Well, I had always thought it was a spiteful act of meaningless malice on Sharkey's part to ruin the Shire. He'd lost his chance at the big hand, but he still could ruin something that was precious and special to the man/wizard who had defeated him at the larger game. It was also a way to poison Gandalf's victory. __________________ I’ll sing his roots off. I’ll sing a wind up and blow leaf and branch away.

12-28-2005, 08:06 PM	#6
Elu Ancalime Shade of Carn Dûm Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Anador Posts: 476	I dont remember the exact statment gandalf said, about capable of doing 'a little bit of meaness'........but i suppose he didnt want the travellers to return to the shire if he could still fight in 'some small way.' i dont think he thought he would 'win,' but with Wormtounge turning on hom and jumping him, i think he had no thought of that at all. if wormtounge didnt stick him, who knows......he might have escaped into the East and set up some small tyranny and brought technologu and industry to men, as Weapons and Warefare put it. I think he knew he couldn't achive anymore in the West, he was just a bug up somebodys shirt. ? odd analogy...... ________ Headshop Last edited by Elu Ancalime; 03-03-2011 at 10:28 PM.

12-28-2005, 10:03 AM	#2
the guy who be short Shadowed Prince Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Thulcandra Posts: 2,343	I'd say it was a mixture of underestimation and Lazy Boss Syndrome. He underestimated the four hobbits in not realising what they'd be able to do before they came to the Shire. Thereafter, he continued to underestimate all hobbitry, allocating the job of keeping order to his Ruffians. He thought they'd be able to handle it themselves without involving him. That's how I see it.

12-28-2005, 07:17 PM	#4
littlemanpoet Itinerant Songster Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: The Edge of Faerie Posts: 7,066	Wanted to die? Do you really think so? Granted, he's been reduced to a shadow (pardon the Tolkienian pun) of what he had been, but death wish? Do you really think he had it thought out that much? Come to think of it, Saruman does seem little wiser than an orc at the end, what with his spiteful revenge and sneering way, especially directed at Wormtongue, who I feel is the second most tragic figure in the entire story after Gollum. Uh oh, I suppose there's a thread about most tragic figure somewhere in all this forum, isn't there?