The mouth of Sauron - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

09-08-2005, 07:16 PM

I have not read the books but i have seen the movies. People keep talking about a mouth of sauron and i have no clue wat they r talkin about.

Glirdan · 09-08-2005, 07:28 PM

Here, I'll try and explain it as best as I can without my books.

After the Battle of the Last Alliance when Isildur took up the Ring and claimed it for his own, Sauron wasn't utterly destroyed. His spirit fled his body and hid in the East for a time. Then he lived in Dul-Guldur(? I forget how to spell it propoerly, if that isn't the way) and got the Nazgul, that is the Black Riders, to make Mordor ready for his return because he knew of the coming of the Istari (the Wizards) and that the White Council was going to attempt to overthrow him. Thus, he feigned retreat and once again took up abode in Mordor. I don't know how long afterwards, he took someone to "be his mouth" and tell everyone what he wanted done. How, I forget. If I missed someting in my explaination, maybe one of the more knowledgeable(?) members, such as Enca, Estel, Legolas, Gil, Fea or maybe the B-W himself could help out.

~Glirdy~

Boromir88 · 09-08-2005, 07:52 PM

jordainian, if you haven't seen ROTK EE you would not be familiar with the Mouth of Sauron. Jackson adds him in the EE.

He is Sauron's herald and ambassador. Lieutenant of Barad-dur. His main purpose in LOTR, as seen was to deliver to Aragorn and co. at the black gate the mithril shirt they found and claiming that their attempt had failed and the poor hobbit Frodo was tortured and killed. He then delivered terms Sauron offered for the everyone to submit to Sauron and pay tribute to him, of course Aragorn denied.

The Mouth was said to be a black Numenorean taken in by Sauron, grew in his favor, and taught him a bit of sorcery. That's really all that's said on the guy. Hope that helps. If you really want to see a good depiction of the Mouth of Sauron I suggest reading the books, instead of watching the movies, because Jackson's movie version I don't think shows too well the Mouth of Sauron's true purpose, to be a messengers. Which was to offer the terms that Sauron gave. He would spare their lives if they submitted fully to Sauron.

Glirdan · 09-08-2005, 07:54 PM

There we go, someone who explained it better. So, did that clear things up?

Alcarillo · 09-08-2005, 07:56 PM

The Mouth of Sauron was also a Black Numenorean, a Numenorean who fell under the sway of Sauron. I doubt he was born in Numenor, probably he was just the descendant of the Numenoreans (perhaps of a garrison of soldiers and women in Umbar). Anyways, in the last years of Numenor the king captured Sauron and took him to Numenor. Sauron rose through the ranks, so to speak, and became the king's advisor. He corrupted the mind of the king, started a satanic religion, and was generally the real ruler of Numenor. The Black Numenoreans were those who followed him.

And I would read the books, if I were you, or our conversations might sound like nothing but elvish babble!

EDIT: Whoops, cross-posted with the last two.

The Perky Ent · 09-08-2005, 09:40 PM

Yes, that part of the book is a pretty fun one. One of those 'Battle of the Witty Insults'. When I think of it, it reminds me of the chapter where Gandalf battles wits with Saruman. Good stuff. It's been described pretty well. Well...since this is in the movie forum, i'll give a little movie description. Well...I'll let the pictures do the talking.

Book Version

Movie Version

Basically, movie version has dental problems, and back spasms.

Ainaserkewen · 09-08-2005, 09:47 PM

Oh I agree Perky. That part of the book was sadistically fun to read. I always love it when the bad guys monologue and think they're so great only to be shot down by the good guys with one clean swipe (which works literally in the movie).

I do prefer the imagination that went into the movie version of our favourite black foe...

Boromir88 · 09-09-2005, 05:07 AM

One thing when reading the book, I actually was more creeped out by the guys horse more than the Mouth of Sauron. His horse is maybe the most frightening description in the books.

Ainaserkewen, I agree, I think the giant peacock hat need not be there, but the rotting teeth, and just showing the Mouth was good imagination on Jackson and the design teams part.

09-08-2005, 07:16 PM	#1
jordainian Guest Posts: n/a	The mouth of Sauron I have not read the books but i have seen the movies. People keep talking about a mouth of sauron and i have no clue wat they r talkin about.

09-08-2005, 07:28 PM	#2
Glirdan Energetic Essence Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Where Lark Nor Eagle Ever Flew Posts: 3,285	Here, I'll try and explain it as best as I can without my books. After the Battle of the Last Alliance when Isildur took up the Ring and claimed it for his own, Sauron wasn't utterly destroyed. His spirit fled his body and hid in the East for a time. Then he lived in Dul-Guldur(? I forget how to spell it propoerly, if that isn't the way) and got the Nazgul, that is the Black Riders, to make Mordor ready for his return because he knew of the coming of the Istari (the Wizards) and that the White Council was going to attempt to overthrow him. Thus, he feigned retreat and once again took up abode in Mordor. I don't know how long afterwards, he took someone to "be his mouth" and tell everyone what he wanted done. How, I forget. If I missed someting in my explaination, maybe one of the more knowledgeable(?) members, such as Enca, Estel, Legolas, Gil, Fea or maybe the B-W himself could help out. ~Glirdy~ __________________ *I'm going to buy you a kitty, I'm going to let you fall in love with the kitty, and one cold, winter night, I'm going to steal into your house and punch you in the face!* Fenris Wolf

09-08-2005, 07:52 PM	#3
Boromir88 Laconic Loreman Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: USA Posts: 7,519	jordainian, if you haven't seen ROTK EE you would not be familiar with the Mouth of Sauron. Jackson adds him in the EE. He is Sauron's herald and ambassador. Lieutenant of Barad-dur. His main purpose in LOTR, as seen was to deliver to Aragorn and co. at the black gate the mithril shirt they found and claiming that their attempt had failed and the poor hobbit Frodo was tortured and killed. He then delivered terms Sauron offered for the everyone to submit to Sauron and pay tribute to him, of course Aragorn denied. The Mouth was said to be a black Numenorean taken in by Sauron, grew in his favor, and taught him a bit of sorcery. That's really all that's said on the guy. Hope that helps. If you really want to see a good depiction of the Mouth of Sauron I suggest reading the books, instead of watching the movies, because Jackson's movie version I don't think shows too well the Mouth of Sauron's true purpose, to be a messengers. Which was to offer the terms that Sauron gave. He would spare their lives if they submitted fully to Sauron. __________________ Fenris Penguin

09-08-2005, 07:54 PM	#4
Glirdan Energetic Essence Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Where Lark Nor Eagle Ever Flew Posts: 3,285	Cheers to Boro!! There we go, someone who explained it better. So, did that clear things up? __________________ *I'm going to buy you a kitty, I'm going to let you fall in love with the kitty, and one cold, winter night, I'm going to steal into your house and punch you in the face!* Fenris Wolf

09-08-2005, 09:40 PM	#6
The Perky Ent Maniacal Mage Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Setting sail for Umbar, with Firefoot at my side! Posts: 3,297	Fear. The city is rank with it Yes, that part of the book is a pretty fun one. One of those 'Battle of the Witty Insults'. When I think of it, it reminds me of the chapter where Gandalf battles wits with Saruman. Good stuff. It's been described pretty well. Well...since this is in the movie forum, i'll give a little movie description. Well...I'll let the pictures do the talking. Book Version Movie Version Basically, movie version has dental problems, and back spasms. __________________ 'But Melkor also was there, and he came to the house of Fëanor, and there he slew Finwë King of the Noldor before his doors, and spilled the first blood in the Blessed Realm; for Finwë alone had not fled from the horror of the Dark.'

09-08-2005, 07:56 PM	#5
Alcarillo Shadow of the Past Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Minas Mor-go Posts: 1,007	The Mouth of Sauron was also a Black Numenorean, a Numenorean who fell under the sway of Sauron. I doubt he was born in Numenor, probably he was just the descendant of the Numenoreans (perhaps of a garrison of soldiers and women in Umbar). Anyways, in the last years of Numenor the king captured Sauron and took him to Numenor. Sauron rose through the ranks, so to speak, and became the king's advisor. He corrupted the mind of the king, started a satanic religion, and was generally the real ruler of Numenor. The Black Numenoreans were those who followed him. And I would read the books, if I were you, or our conversations might sound like nothing but elvish babble! EDIT: Whoops, cross-posted with the last two.

09-08-2005, 09:47 PM	#7
Ainaserkewen Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: A cosmic waiting room Posts: 651	Oh I agree Perky. That part of the book was sadistically fun to read. I always love it when the bad guys monologue and think they're so great only to be shot down by the good guys with one clean swipe (which works literally in the movie). I do prefer the imagination that went into the movie version of our favourite black foe... __________________ Solus... I'm eating chicken again. I ate chicken yesterday and the day before... will I be eating chicken again tomorrow? Why am I always eating chicken?

09-09-2005, 05:07 AM	#8
Boromir88 Laconic Loreman Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: USA Posts: 7,519	One thing when reading the book, I actually was more creeped out by the guys horse more than the Mouth of Sauron. His horse is maybe the most frightening description in the books. Ainaserkewen, I agree, I think the giant peacock hat need not be there, but the rotting teeth, and just showing the Mouth was good imagination on Jackson and the design teams part. __________________ Fenris Penguin