Learning about LOTR

[Linaeve]

OK, I'm almost certain this question has been posted here about a million times, but I did ten searches using all different key words (maybe I used the wrong ones?) and couldn't find anything, so if someone could link me to a pre-existing thread (assuming, of course, that there is one), I'd be very grateful.

Anyway, to get to the point: I'm just astounded by the level of LOTR knowledge I've encountered in Barrowdowners new and old. How did you learn so many details? Did you just comb through the books? Or did you go through all the outside sources? Also, I'm interested in buying The History of Middle Earth, but as it consists of 12 volumes, I was wondering whether it's worth going through all 12 volumes, or whether there are specific volumes that I should start with. Finally, do the Letters of J.R.R. Tolkien contain any information that we won't learn from HOME or LOTR?

Thanks in advance for any info! I love LOTR. Unfortunately, being a senior in high school, I have a very limited amount of time that I can dedicated to reading all things LOTR, but I REALLY want to find out whatever I can, since I like knowing about origins and what-not, so that's why I'm asking all these absurd questions [img]smilies/smile.gif[/img]

[ 4:07 PM December 03, 2003: Message edited by: Linaeve ]

[Imladris]

I'm not too Knowledgeable about LotR compared to some, but I got a lot of my information from the Tolkien Bestiary by David Day. It basically has a short summary (well, not always short, but you get the meaning) about basically everything in Middle-earth. Like he has summaries and pages about Sindarin, Silvan, and some other elves that I had never heard of before. He has write ups about the valar and maiar (even has some specific persons, I think). There are some pretty...ugly pictures in there, but on the whole, I think it is worth buying since it also gives sketcy history details and so forth.

I'm sorry I can't recommend anything more than this since that's all I've read -- except for LotR a thousand or so times... [img]smilies/wink.gif[/img]

[Meela]

You're questions aren't absurd [img]smilies/smile.gif[/img] I've asked a fair few questions about where to find information in the past.

Okay, I'm not much of an expert myself, but I can answer a couple of points.

I have nine out of twelve of the HoME volumes, and it is worth collecting them, but probably only if you want to collect all of Tolkien's works, or you wish to study everything. I haven't bought them in order recently; instead I often look at the content of each one, and if I happen to have the money, will buy a volume that interests me in particular, eg. the last one I bought was War of the Ring, because I wanted to read more on Denethor and Faramir and current events of the Third Age. But if you prefer studying the First Age, pick up some of the first volumes instead. The first one I bought was volume 3, because I was enchanted by Luthien (Volume 3 contains the Lay of Luthien).

I think the Letters of Tolkien contain some additional information, but having not read them, I can't really say.

As for my own learning... obviously I'm working my way through the HoME volumes, but I only go for what specifically interests me. The other volumes are simply collectibles. If you don't feel particularly interested in one area, don't study it. It's not worth wasting your time just because you feel you have to cover everything.

I personally enjoy reading the appendices in Rotk. And my encyclopedia of all things Rotk. And indexes.
Appendices~ lots of condensed information in easy-to-take-in tables, chronologies, family trees, etc. The information is information that I want to learn, and it's in a good, quick form. Fun reading. Has some good stuff on Denethor.
Encyclopedia~ this actually came into use when I began typing it up for my site, so I doubt it's actually fun to read like a book. But occasionally I do flick through and read random entries, and I pick up some interesting facts.
Indexes~ again, not general reading, but a personal use. I wanted to choose names for myself and my future kids, so naturally I flicked through the index. If anything or anyone sounds interesting, I look them/it up. Instant information.

Okay, so most of what I do is kinda dull and only applies if you have too much time on your hands, as I do.
Basically, choose something that appeals to you, eg. a particular volume of HoME, or just a section of the Appendices, and read it. Or you can methodically work through every book, but you may find that too tedious and time consuming.
You don't need to pick everything up, and definitely not at once. Just start with something interesting. That's what I did. It's been a while, but I'm getting somewhere.

Hope some of my rambling helps [img]smilies/smile.gif[/img] once I start I can't stop, and I more often than not lose track, but there's something of a reply built in. Have fun learning!

[Linaeve]

Meela, don't worry, your post was very helpful! And thanks, Imladris, I'll definitely look into that- it sounds fascinating!

I want to read anything and everything relating to Lord of the Rings, including both things that Tolkien wrote himself and that others wrote, but I just don't have the time to sit and read through everything during one sitting, which is how I like to read things (I read the Lord of the Rings books in a week and a half). Maybe when I graduate from college I'll have time, but my reading list spans over 50 books right now (of course anything Lord of the Rings is on the top), so if I go crazy, you know why [img]smilies/rolleyes.gif[/img]

[Estelyn Telcontar]

Linaeve, that's a very good question - there are some threads about supplementary literature; if I find them I'll edit this post to add them.

A search for "David Day" either on this forum or Books should show up threads that deal with his works - in short, they are not entirely reliable and have much additional information that does not come from Tolkien.

I have found Humphrey Carpenter's Tolkien biography to be very interesting in giving his personal background, as well as the 'Letters', edited by Carpenter. As a reference book, I have Robert Foster's 'Complete Guide to Middle-earth' - good for looking up names, places and other facts.

Tolkien's short works, especially 'Leaf by Niggle' and 'Smith of Wootton Major', give a small glimpse into his heart, since they have an autobiographical touch - and they're easy to read quickly.

I also very much enjoyed Tom Shippey's 'J.R.R.Tolkien - Author of the Century' for insight into his writing; his 'Road to Middle-earth' also deals with literary aspects.

I'm working on the 'History of Middle-earth', but it does take time - I can feel with your dilemma about having so many things to read!

I hope you get lots of helpful answers!

[Imladris]

A search for "David Day" either on this forum or Books should show up threads that deal with his works - in short, they are not entirely reliable and have much additional information that does not come from Tolkien.

What?! Bother! Grr... [img]smilies/mad.gif[/img] I'm sorry Linaeve...I didn't know or else I most certainly would not have recommended them (maybe I should hang out in the book section more often...)

Thanks, Estelyn.

[Knight of Gondor]

Linaeve, I'm not so very far away from your age at all, and I still find a fair amount of time to read up. My knowledge came mostly from reading the histories, but I've only read The Silmarillion and the two books of lost tales. My suggestion is that you read the appendices of RotK and find out whether you're really up to all that technical stuff about Middle-Earth. If you are, then buy/borrow a copy of The Silmarillion and read it. I have yet to tackle the rest of the histories, but they're on my Christmas list this year.

Meantime, stick with this board, you'll learn plenty!

[Child of the 7th Age]

Linaeve,

The Letters do contain some information that is not in HoMe. Just as importantly, they are much more concise and very readable.

They let us into JRRT's mind, shedding insight on a lot of the characters and scenes in the book. There were times when I was reading the Letters and my jaw would drop open as a light bulb went on in my head... so that's what Tolkien meant!

I do have all the volumes of HoMe. Some, I've read cover to cover. Others I use mainly for reference, but have promised myself that I'll eventually plough through them all.

I think it's great that you're thinking of expanding your reading! But if you get into something that seems too 'heavy', just set it aside for a month or so, stick around the books forum, and try it again later. I found it much easier to get through something like Morgoth's Ring, for example, (HoMe X) after I'd learned a lot from everyone's posts.

Good luck!

[Lady Snickerdoodle]

Welcome Linaeve by the way. I don't know if I'm repeating anything other people here said (because I'm too lazy to read through everyone's replies, and I have to go somewhere in a minute anyway) but yeah, reading the Silmarillion gives a lot of background knowledge and history and so do the other ones, like the Book of Lost Tales, all the other ones... And there are way too many LOTR fan sites out there (but barrowdowns is best! [img]smilies/biggrin.gif[/img] ) but they all too often tend to gush about Orlando Bloom (which isn't that bad, but when you want LOTR info...) but the History of Middle earth isnt too bad if you actually have the stamina to get through 12 volumes... good luck!

[Everdawn]

What do I do???... I read Tolkien, and then i usually use the Encyclopedia of Arda which I got from the RP Resources for the Shire. That site is great. And then to remember everything ive read, ill jot down notes or write a quick summary.

If its a rainy day and im at home alone, ill write a full paper on a subject. Compared to many people here though, "I know nothing!", or so it seems. (lol). I also think ive learned a lot from reading threads here. Isnt there a board which has past topics somewhere? Anyway, i read them from time to time. Thats what is so great about the Downs, you learn from others.

[The Squatter of Amon Rûdh]

It's hard to describe how I got to know what little I know about Tolkien, but the story can be told fairly briefly: I started off with The Hobbit, then read The Lord of the Rings a few years later. At the time that was enough, but later I started to look for the other books mentioned in the fly-leaf, starting with the Silmarillion. I wasn't really aware of learning anything at the time, but later I realised that I'd been getting to know a thing or two in the same way that one might learn the words to a favourite song: I read, I thought about it, and there was the knowledge. After a while I started collecting the additional Silmarillion material, starting with Unfinished Tales, and at the same time I started taking an interest in Tolkien's opinions on other subjects.

The Letters were a real eye-opener for me as well. As Child mentions, Tolkien's correspondance style is entertaining and readable, and the latest edition has a comprehensive index and improved system of notes, so looking up particular issues (or even some famous comments of Tolkien's) becomes surprisingly easy. Personally I read them from cover to cover, but they can be just as valuable if you start with the subjects that most interest you and gradually work your way through them.

If you want to understand The Silmarillion in depth, then The History of Middle-earth is an essential resource: it has many, many texts written between about 1915 and Tolkien's death, including material not even alluded to in the previously published works. Amongst other things you'll find Ælfwine's original translations into Old English of various historical documents of the Elves, every stanza Tolkien wrote of the Lay of Leithian along with commentary on the earlier verses by C.S. Lewis, and a number of essays concerning the legends. The only full account of the Fall of Gondolin is there in the Book of Lost Tales II, and every legend from the Silmarillion is traced through various texts that Tolkien wrote and left in diverse stages of completion. Even if you don't care much for the academic analysis of Tolkien's writing, there's a wealth of fantastic poetry and prose in there that never saw the light of day during its author's lifetime.

I'd also advise reading some of Tolkien's professional work, some of the less complicated examples of which are published in a collection called The Monsters and the Critics and Other Essays. Middle-earth was a hobby, but Tolkien studied English language and literature for a living, and his professional opinions often find their way into his fiction. You can discover a lot about what he was trying to achieve in his books by looking at what he had to say about the works of earlier writers. Don't stop with Tolkien, though: there are a lot of very good essays about his works, many of them available on-line.

Basically, though, my advice is to read what you enjoy and then see where it leads you. It never does any harm to come back to material that you've read in the past and see where new knowledge (or just general experience) can give you a fresh insight. This isn't an academic course, though, and not everybody finds delving through mouldy vellum deeply rewarding. There's no sin in seeing a book just as a good story, but if you want to get a deep insight into what it's all about, there are plenty of resources for doing it. This forum is one of them. Now read on...

[Daisy Brambleburr]

The way I learned (although I'm no Tolkien scholar) was quite gradual. I've been into LotR for about 1 and a half/ 2 years, but I never went out of my way to discover new things. It all came natrually. Because I was interested I read the books, watched the movies, read the books s'more, went to a heck of a lot of websites (this one, as well as many others) and participated in forums like these. I found that it helps to find yourself a LotR e-mail pal, I've got two, and as long as your sensible (no personal information, etc) it can work out well. We have some pretty long discussions! I'm not one to force myself to read stuff I don't want to, which is why I haven't read the Silmarillion yet. In time, I will begin it, but not right now.
So just give it time, and I'm sure more knowledge will come to you!

[Bêthberry]

In support of earlier comments, I would suggest looking at another of Tolkien's professional essays, "On Fairy-Stories." It does not so much explain the mythology or languages which Tolkien imagined as present his defense of the importance of fantasy (faërie or the perilous realm) as something applicable and important for adults.

I would, however, wish to suggest a slight caution about both The Letters and Carpenter's Biography--and this is from the rather pedantic perspective of boring old scholarship.

Both are engaging, highly readable books and valuable. But neither is truly definitive. Both authors owe great debts to the courtesy of the Tolkien family for granting access to papers; there could well be many ways in which the family's wish, even unconsciously, to provide a particular view of the man influenced the selection of information and perspective given in the books.

For instance, Carpenter's opening chapter, "A Visit", belongs to the tradition of literary biography first established by the novelist Elizabeth Gaskell in her ground-breaking biography of Charlotte Brontë. This, in itself, is not evidence of flaw or error, but it suggests that Carpenter was writing both an interpretation of the man and of the genre.

It would, for instance, be fascinating to read all of Tolkien's letters to Edith Bratt, which are quoted only sparingly. And, as Carpenter acknowledges, much of Tolkien's correspondence still remains untraced.

These resources are, for now, preliminary studies of the man and it is wise not to view them them as carved in stone.