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01-19-2014, 01:40 PM | #1 |
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Elven Characteristics
Hello, unfortunately I do not own the HoME. I would like to ask if there is any passage which says that elves are more slender than humans and that they're beardless. I think in the Lost Tales there is a passage where the elves of Gondolin are astonished at Tuors deep voice. Does anyone else know this passage? Did Tolkien imagine elves with higher voices than humans? Thank you!
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01-19-2014, 01:57 PM | #2 | |
Shade of Carn Dûm
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 435
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01-20-2014, 08:51 AM | #3 | ||||
Ghost Prince of Cardolan
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 1,034
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It's also noted that the Noldoli that came forth to see Tuor marvelled at his stature and gaunt limbs. At the moment I'm not sure about slenderness but I think maybe the Elves of the Lost Tales were notably shorter than they would later become, especially considering some old descriptions, including: Quote:
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The concept of the Elves and Men being of like height -- because Men were smaller 'back then' and Elves taller -- appears in the Lay of Turin, but when we get to the 'early Silmarillions' and Silmarillion-related texts of the 1930s we seem to move to simpler comparisons between Men and Elves -- that is, they are of like height, with Men somewhat taller (especially the Hadorians), but without the comparative reference to the stature of Men in earlier times versus 'now'. And then again there are even later references to Elven height, compared to Men or Numenoreans. I think the external chronology [when Tolkien wrote what text] is important here, even if it doesn't necessarily answer all our questions. Last edited by Galin; 01-20-2014 at 09:00 AM. |
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01-20-2014, 01:02 PM | #4 |
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@Alfirin: Thank you!
@Galin: Oh no, now I'm even more confused! I always imagined elves taller than humans. So actually we do not know what Tolkien thought towards the end of his life, and even that would have been transitory. I guess I'll just go with my own imagination. Thank you! |
01-20-2014, 02:10 PM | #5 | ||
Wight
Join Date: Dec 2006
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In the Grey Annals we have this statement for year 422:
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Quendi and Eldar has the following: Quote:
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Then one appeared among us, in our own form visible, but greater and more beautiful; and he said that he had come out of pity. |
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01-20-2014, 04:06 PM | #6 | |
Shade of Carn Dûm
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 276
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I would imagine the elves in general were tall and wiry. Closer to the Aragorn build than Boromir. |
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01-20-2014, 05:41 PM | #7 | |
Wisest of the Noldor
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Anyway- welcome to the Downs!
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"Even Nerwen wasn't evil in the beginning." –Elmo. |
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01-20-2014, 05:48 PM | #8 | ||||
Ghost Prince of Cardolan
Join Date: May 2007
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In '1968 or later', according to a text called Of Dwarves And Men we have: Quote:
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Anyway, both texts are late. Another (seemingly) late note says that Celeborn was held by the Lindar of Valinor to be tall: '... but the Teleri were in general somewhat less in build and stature than the Noldor.' (this note is mentioned in the same section as the following on Galadriel). In yet another late note (Appendix, Numenorean Linear Measures, Unfinished Tales) Galadriel is noted as six foot four. And in The Lord of the Rings it was said concerning Galadriel and Celeborn: 'Very tall they were, and the Lady no less tall than the Lord;...' There is also (now) variant text concerning Elendil the Tall -- well, I consider it variant from Unfinished Tales anyway. 'Aragorn, direct descendant of Elendil and his son Isildur, both of whom had been seven feet tall, must nonetheless have been a very tall man…, probably at least 6 ft. 6; and Boromir, of high Númenorean lineage, not much shorter (say 6 ft. 4).' longer version... Quote:
But there's some relatively late citations; and much later than The Book of Lost Tales anyway |
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01-20-2014, 05:50 PM | #9 |
Ghost Prince of Cardolan
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 1,034
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Didn't see your post earlier Nerwen, but yes you are correct about what I meant.
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01-21-2014, 03:03 PM | #10 |
Newly Deceased
Join Date: Jan 2014
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Thank you so much
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