Gandalf blew Galadriel's cover?! - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

Gorthaur the Cruel · 12-22-2005, 11:24 AM

When Gandalf decided to praise Galadriel by reciting his little song rhyme of her beautiful, magical realm infront of the Rohan court infront of Wormtongue especially, was he losing his wits?! The bearers of the Three were meant to be secret & yet he was publicly glorifying Galadriel & her elven ring!

12-22-2005, 02:55 PM

Well, I think you should be a real Sherlock to figure from "White is the star in your white hand" that one of the three is in Lothlórien. In fact, I'm not even sure if it really refers to the ring, but instead being a metaphor for something else.

Edit: Crossposted with Lindolirian. You made a good point about Sam.

Lindolirian · 12-22-2005, 02:55 PM

Quote:

In Dwimordene, in Lorien
Seldom have walked the feet of Men,
Few mortal eyes have seen the light
That lies there ever long and bright.
Galadriel! Galadriel!
Clear is the water of your well;
White is the star in your white hand;
Unmarred, unstained is leaf and land
In Dwimordene, in Lorien
More fair than thoughts of Mortal Men

I can see where it seems that Gandalf mentions Nenya, but you have to remember, only such things are evident to those who bear a Ring of Power themselves. Sam was present when Lady Galadriel showed her Ring to Frodo, but since is is not a Ring-Bearer all he saw was a white star in her white hand. Gandalf must have seen no harm in putting out what many would have thought to be a metaphor for power.

*Edit* Crosspost with Eyrie: Good points... hahaha, it seems we agree.

Farael · 12-22-2005, 03:10 PM

But then, should Sauron hear those verses he might be able to guess where one of the Three is at. Yet Sauron might have know already, I think I recall Galadriel saying that the enemy tried to look into her lands but he could not... perhaps Sauron knew there was a ring in there?

I'm not too sure if white is the star in your white hand is a metaphor for power... English is my second language so it might just be, but it did not bring up thoughts of power to me. But then, my LoTR is in Spanish and I do not pay much attention to songs and poetry in the book because they are ill translated.

Also, if Frodo could see the rings, why didn't he see Gandalf's? just a bit of a side thought that popped up into my head.

Lindolirian · 12-22-2005, 03:48 PM

I took that star to be a metaphor for power in that stars are inherently "elvish" representing their power to make and sustain beauty. The next phrase in the poem speaks of how the land remains unmarred and unstained. I didn't mean that her Ring represented military might, but a power of protection of a secret place and its beauty.
Now as for Frodo not being able to see Narya, I suppose it might be because Gandalf never came out and showed it to him as Galadriel did.

Formendacil · 12-22-2005, 04:48 PM

I highly doubt if Sauron would have been surprised to find a Ring in Lothlorien. The same goes for Rivendell. Both realms had a supernatural aura and were ruled by mighty, powerful Elves who had been around in Celebrimbor's time. It was probably only Gandalf's Ring that was truly hidden from Sauron.

Farael · 12-23-2005, 10:05 PM

Correct me if I'm wrong, but wouldn't one (or two even) of the Three make Sauron even more powerful? I do agree (even though I had not thought of it before until it was mentioned here) that he knew there was a Ring in Rivendell and another in Lorien. I don't know exactly how strong both cities were, but why didn't he attack them and recover at least two of the three? then he'd be even mightyer and he might have been able to crush Gondor in spite of Aragorn and Gandalf's best efforts.

12-22-2005, 11:24 AM	#1
Gorthaur the Cruel Wight Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Mordor Posts: 150	Gandalf blew Galadriel's cover?! When Gandalf decided to praise Galadriel by reciting his little song rhyme of her beautiful, magical realm infront of the Rohan court infront of Wormtongue especially, was he losing his wits?! The bearers of the Three were meant to be secret & yet he was publicly glorifying Galadriel & her elven ring! __________________ I am Annatar, the Lord of Gifts.

12-22-2005, 03:48 PM	#5
Lindolirian World's Tallest Hobbit Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Where the view is long Posts: 2,117	I took that star to be a metaphor for power in that stars are inherently "elvish" representing their power to make and sustain beauty. The next phrase in the poem speaks of how the land remains unmarred and unstained. I didn't mean that her Ring represented military might, but a power of protection of a secret place and its beauty. Now as for Frodo not being able to see Narya, I suppose it might be because Gandalf never came out and showed it to him as Galadriel did. __________________ 'They say that the One will himself enter into Arda, and heal Men and all the Marring from the beginning to the end."

12-22-2005, 04:48 PM	#6
Formendacil Dead Serious Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Perched on Thangorodrim's towers. Posts: 3,326	I highly doubt if Sauron would have been surprised to find a Ring in Lothlorien. The same goes for Rivendell. Both realms had a supernatural aura and were ruled by mighty, powerful Elves who had been around in Celebrimbor's time. It was probably only Gandalf's Ring that was truly hidden from Sauron. __________________ I prefer history, true or feigned.

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12-22-2005, 02:55 PM	#2
Eyrie Guest Posts: n/a	Well, I think you should be a real Sherlock to figure from "White is the star in your white hand" that one of the three is in Lothlórien. In fact, I'm not even sure if it really refers to the ring, but instead being a metaphor for something else. Edit: Crossposted with Lindolirian. You made a good point about Sam.

12-22-2005, 03:10 PM	#4
Farael Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: In hospitals, call rooms and (rarely) my apartment. Posts: 1,538	But then, should Sauron hear those verses he might be able to guess where one of the Three is at. Yet Sauron might have know already, I think I recall Galadriel saying that the enemy tried to look into her lands but he could not... perhaps Sauron knew there was a ring in there? I'm not too sure if white is the star in your white hand is a metaphor for power... English is my second language so it might just be, but it did not bring up thoughts of power to me. But then, my LoTR is in Spanish and I do not pay much attention to songs and poetry in the book because they are ill translated. Also, if Frodo could see the rings, why didn't he see Gandalf's? just a bit of a side thought that popped up into my head.

12-23-2005, 10:05 PM	#7
Farael Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: In hospitals, call rooms and (rarely) my apartment. Posts: 1,538	Correct me if I'm wrong, but wouldn't one (or two even) of the Three make Sauron even more powerful? I do agree (even though I had not thought of it before until it was mentioned here) that he knew there was a Ring in Rivendell and another in Lorien. I don't know exactly how strong both cities were, but why didn't he attack them and recover at least two of the three? then he'd be even mightyer and he might have been able to crush Gondor in spite of Aragorn and Gandalf's best efforts.