Arwen leaving Rivendell...

[Arwen1858]

I haven't posted on here in ages, but I have a question that's really bugging me now, and since I haven't yet bought TTT movie, and can't satisfy my curiousity by watching it now. I read somewhere on a LOTR fansite that in the movie TTT, Arwen left Rivendell and went to the undying lands. Is that where she went? I didn't think that was where she was going. Did I miss something, or what? I'm somewhat new to Tolkien, and am reading through the books for a second time right now. Any help on this matter would be <I>greatly</I> appreciated!! Thanks!<BR>Arwen

[Lush]

While I'm a big fan of the movies I believe that the particular bit in the movie was one of the examples of Peter Jackson being utterly <I>retarded</I>.<P>Of course Arwen doesn't go to the Undying Lands. Perhaps PJ & Co. wanted to up the dramatics a notch by making it seem as if she left, but here they failed miserably (it worked much better with the chase scene with the Nine in FotR).

[Phervasaion]

I agree with Lush in this matter. I dont know where she could have been going though if she wasnt going to the undyingn lands.

[Arwen1858]

Here's what I read:<BR><A HREF="http://www.homeoftheelves.com/Arwen.htm" TARGET=_blank>Arwen</A><P>Now, me not knowing the story too well, I wondered if maybe I was confused. I didn't think elves went to Valinor and came back, and certainly not Arwen, but then I read that. And it wasn't 30 more years, was it? <BR>I personally think Arwen stayed true to Aragorn, and never wavered in her decision to give up her immortality for him.

[Phervasaion]

I think your right Arwen. In the book you dont hear anything about Arwen leaving for the undying lands. Im also pretty sure that it wasnt 30 years until they both met again and got married because they met up virtually as soon as the war had finidhed. Im not entirely sure about this but i never thought they were away from each other so long.

[Elentári_O_Most_Mighty_1]

Hmm, I don't know where they got the 30 years from...Most of that history is slightly warped. As far as I'm aware she did NOT spend most of her life in Lothlórien, she just spent periods there...but I could be wrong.<P>It has been suggested that Arwen was going to take Aragorn his reforged sword and standard. I didn't realise that he didn't have that sword already, but hey...<P>And I for one DID think she was off to the Undying Lands... But then, I was so rattled at all the changes anyway that I didn't put it past PJ to make a change such as that. I just assumed she would be stopped before she got there. Oh well...

[peonydeepdelver]

I dunno. I have this picture in my mind of the opening sequence of ROTK, where they reshow Arwen looking back at Elrond, then she makes her way to the back of the line of Elves once she's out of his sight. Then she runs into the forest and resteals Glorfindel's horse and goes to Pelennor Fields, where Eowyn is moments from death and Arwen kills the Witch-king and takes all the glory. *nods* That's exactly what will happen.

[Arwen1858]

I always wonderedif maybe she was going to Lothlorien. Cuz there is that picture that's been on the net for some time now of Arwen and Galadriel. So maybe that's where she went. Maybe we'll find out in TTT EE..<BR>Arwen

[HCIsland]

Sorry Arwen1858, it's that site that's "retarded".<P>Elrond sent Arwen from Rivendell for the Undying Lands, but it should be obvious that she's not going there, even to someone who hasn't read the books.<P>I would put good money down, that she has Anduril under that cloak. Those with the DVD, check out the looks Arwen and Elrond are shooting eachother. Arwen is saying goodbye forever to her father while Elrond is wondering what this crazy daughter of his is up to.<P>H.C.

[Arwen1858]

Thanks, HCIsland. That was the feeling I got, with the looks they were giving each other. But then I read that site, and thought maybe my lack of knowledge of the story just got me confused or something. Well, I'm glad to know I was right in what I thought up front!<BR>Arwen

[Aduyuldaiel-MirkwoodPrincess]

i definately think that PJ did a HORRIBLE job with that part in the movie...although it was still good...in a sence if you get what im saying and if you dont thats OK too i would suggest reading the story of aragorn and arwen in the book...its the best way to answer ur question

[Arathiriel]

Arwen was going to Lothlorien and <B>not</B> Valinor as some have theorized - I mean if she leaves M-E I will be ready to go after PJ myself for changing her and Aragorn's storyline <I>that</I> much!<P>

[Arwen1858]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR> I mean if she leaves M-E I will be ready to go after PJ myself for changing her and Aragorn's storyline that much! <HR></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>I'll go with you! He'd better not do that!

[Elfchick7]

Honestly ya'll. Remember that P.J. has to do things to leave people hanging in TTT so that they will come and see ROTK. I think he put that in there to lead the audience into thinking that Arwen leaves M.E. and Eowyn gets Aragorn. Remember there are things that we havn't seen in the Special Edition. I specificly remember a line that Liv has in the trailer for TTT: Arwen is running into a garden in Rivendell towards Elrond who is under some sort of gazebo. As she runs her shawl slip off her back. She say,"You have the gift of forsight, tell me what you have seen." I think that as always there is more to this that meets the eye. Maybe P.J. is sticking closer t o the book the we thought. Maybe Arwen is being escorted by some Rivendell elves to Gnodor and she stops at "Grandma's house" on the way. I too have seen this picture but it was not on any site, it was in the LOTR visual movie companion at my local Books-A-Million. So I am not worried. Let's give P.J. the benifit of the doubt and no sew Him till after ROTK comes out.

[samrohan]

Don't you guys worry about Arwen leaving Rivendell. PJ has modified the storyline but he would not have modified it to the point of having her leave ME. She indeed probably carries Anduril under her cloak and is only on her way to Gondor or Lothlorien to give it to Aragorn.

[HCIsland]

And this worries you?<P>Anduril has to get from Rivendell to Aragorn, so this seems rather obvious. She either gives it to him personally or passes it on to someone else to give him. I'm hoping the later.<P>What worries me is that Arwen ends up hanging around for a while or shows at Pelennor, but personally I don't think this will happen. Aragorn obviously gets Anduril before the Paths of the Dead and it is also obvious that Arwen isn't with him at this point. This leaves her to travel with Gandalf or the Rohirrim. Neither works. Shots of Gandalf racing through the woods has him alone and having Arwen and Eowyn hanging together is awkward to the point of laughable. Yet we do have shots of her and Galadriel together, so it seems sensible to think she heads off for Lorien.<P>H.C.

[Lyta_Underhill]

I have heard suggestions that Gandalf, Theoden, Aragorn, et. al. return to Edoras after the events at Isengard and that Merry and Pippin are there as well, suggesting they go Helm's Deep-->Isengard-->Edoras. Perhaps Arwen shows up at Edoras and slips Aragorn his stuff out of sight of the others? Then Aragorn slips off for his mental wrestling match with Sauron through the Palantir and is then fully equipped for his journey. Arwen would seem to be the one to bring the "remember the Paths of the Dead" reminder as well, unless Gandalf ends up with this role, having come from Lothlorien and/or having the ability to instantly communicate with Elrond and Galadriel through the Elven Rings (as is suggested in the Elrond/Galadriel sequence in TTT). Just a few thoughts/speculations!<P>Cheers,<BR>Lyta

[HCIsland]

Merry and Pippin are definately together at Edoras. This can be seen in the preview packaged with TTT DVD, so I agree that it goes Helm's Deep->Isengard->Edoras. I disagree about Aragorn and the Palantir. I think this won't happen until after the battle on Pelennor.<P>H.C.

[Lyta_Underhill]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>I disagree about Aragorn and the Palantir. I think this won't happen until after the battle on Pelennor.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>Interesting...so this would be part of Aragorn's strategy to draw Sauron's attention away from Frodo and Sam in Mordor. Makes sense, I suppose!<P>Another thought I had; it could be purposed that Arwen reach the Grey Havens for one reason: she could be given the "token" for passage on the ship to the West, then decide to keep it for her ultimate use of it--a gift to Frodo at the end of his quest. It would be a good way to illustrate it so everyone could see a clear train of thought. Arwen gives up her passage, not only for Aragorn and a mortal life, but to provide a measure of healing for Frodo. I must admit I am looking forward to Arwen's gift to Frodo in ROTK. It is a favorite moment of mine and I hope it is included. <P>Cheers,<BR>Lyta

[Jack]

I was a little confused by that as well! Lush is right about PJ being retarded, but I see why it would be suspenseful for other people. In my mind (at least until recently) there is no doubt that Arwen is going to marry Aragorn! (Some of you might have read my post about Eowen and Aragorn) I just has to happen!

[Arwen1858]

Oh, I wasn't really doubting their marriage. I just really don't want him kissing Eowyn. I like Eowyn, she just doesn't belong to Aragorn. I don't care if he thought Arwen had gone to the undying lands. I still believe he would stay faithful to her, and not even think about anyone else in that way.

[HCIsland]

Good gravy!!!<P>Will people please look back and see that there is absolutely no evidence for a kissing scene between Aragorn and Eowyn.<P>Nothing. Nada. Zilch.<P>If you are going to get upset about something, at least make it something that there is a smidge of evidence to support.<P>H.C.

[Arwen1858]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR> Will people please look back and see that there is absolutely no evidence for a kissing scene between Aragorn and Eowyn. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>except for an interview I read in a magazine where they said the might. I think the interview was with Philipps Boyens, but I don't remember for sure. So there <I>is</I> a possibility.

[Elentári_O_Most_Mighty_1]

NOOOOOOOOOOOO!!! There had better not be...<BR>Now I remember somewhere I wrote that I thought there might not be the palantír in there at all. But I can't remember where, and I can't remember why. It was something to do with Frodo....hmm...<P>Ok, I'll give it a shot:<BR>The Nazgul knows that the Ring was in Osgiliath, he was drawn to it, Frodo offers it and Faramir inexplicably lets him go.<BR>Therefore Sauron is not going to be fooled into thinking that Pippin looking into Saruman's palantír is the hobbit with the Ring held at Isengard. So there will not be the whole thing of Gandalf &co thinking Sauron thinks Pippin has the Ring.<P>....somehow this made sense to me when I first thought of it....

[The Saucepan Man]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR> Good gravy!!! <HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P> <P> <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR> If you are going to get upset about something, at least make it something that there is a smidge of evidence to support. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>We're swimming against the tide here, HC. <P> <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR> Now I remember somewhere I wrote that I thought there might not be the palantír in there at all. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>In one of the trailers that I have seen, Merry is telling Pippin that Sauron believes him to be the Ringbearer. Which suggests to me that Pippin and the Palantir are in RotK.<P>But you are right. I does takes away what (scant) justification there was for having Frodo seen with the Ring in Osgiliath en route to Minas Tirith.

[Lomadia]

>there is absolutely no evidence for a kissing scene between Aragorn and Eowyn.<P> They had better not have a kiss scene! In the book, Aragorn never even considers abandoning Arwen for Eowyn. He understands that Eowyn thinks she is in love with him, but this only makes him pity her even more, which she cannot stand, and she eventually realizes that she was only in love with the idea of adventure.<P> As for Sauron thinking that Pippin is the Ringbearer, this will definitely be in the film, as it is mentioned in the preview for RotK that's on TTT DVD.<P> My friend and I were trying to figure out the whole scene with Arwen leaving Rivendell. Obviously, the idea is to lead the audience to believe that Arwen's gone to Valinor. We were thinking that maybe she was leaving with the elves for Helm's Deep, but the cloaks are different. Maybe she starts for the Grey Havens, but then turns back? But I think that the idea that she ends up in Lorien before reaching Gondor is the most likely story.<P> I don't understand what everyone's saying about Arwen bringing Aragorn his sword. In the book, isn't Narsil reforged into Anduril before the Fellowship leaves Rivendell, and doesn't Aragorn carry it with him all the way from Rivendell to Minas Tirith? Is this being changed in the film? I know there are scenes from yesterday's trailer where Arwen tells Elrond that the sword should be reforged and given to Aragorn, but I assumed this would be another flashback, like those we saw in TTT.<BR> Namarie,<BR> Lomadia

[Arwen1858]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR> Maybe she starts for the Grey Havens, but then turns back? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>No! At least, I hope not! I personally don't think she ever wavered in her decision to marry Aragorn and become mortal. I always thought she was going to Lothlorien in the movie. There's been a pic on the net for a long time of her and Galadriel, so I assumed she was going there. I guess we'll find out Decemeber 17! Ah! So long to wait!<BR>Arwen

[Gorwingel]

I always thought that the scene where it looks like Arwen is leaving Rivendell in TTT, is actually just a dream kind of thing that Aragorn has. You know, just, maybe he was thinking of the worst possible case and that was it. I never thought at one time that she was actually leaving. Though I kind of thought it was a cool scene. It came out really beautiful